Electus Matari Forums

Hi, I'm sure some of you remember me. Hi! // Garbled transmission removed.

But I had to admit that it was a brilliant execution of how a tiny pirate corp would respond to aggression from a large active anti-pirate alliance - mere days after we put up our POS network no less! I found it refreshing// Garbled transmission removed.. Thanks!

At any rate, I hate to bother you again, but today I was flying through Floseswin, Metropolis and saw a pair of your pilots - Tasadare and Yen Mei of Covenants United - engaging in an act of outright piracy (mission busting) against ABNTanker of the corp Brutor Tribe.

Being as how I'm the nice neighborly sort (and mostly because I find it hilarious for an anti-pirate alliance to be caught pirating red handed!), I've decided to report this to you.

Here's the chat log:
[04:30:50] Kismo > I was waiting for that.
[04:32:21] Kismo > nice loki. I assume the Proteus is with you?
[04:53:09] Kismo > LOL
[04:53:13] Kismo > And I thought Electus Matari was anti pirate
[04:53:42] Tasadare > and we are
[04:53:48] ABNTanker > ?
[04:53:54] Hesperius > then why did you attack and kill abntanker?
[04:54:05] Kismo > Which is why you have GCCs and a neutral hurricane wreck is on d-scan
[04:54:06] Tasadare > agression
[04:54:26] Hesperius > Funny, you are the one with the GCC
[04:54:37] ABNTanker > I tried warping out when I saw you and you scrambled me
[04:55:35] Tasadare > ABN, you're red toward Covenants United
[04:55:46] Kismo > Brutor Tribe is red to you?
[04:55:48] Kismo > *REALLY*?
[04:55:50] ABNTanker > how?
[04:55:56] Kismo > You can't set corp standings to individuals.
[04:56:18] Hesperius > tisk tisk
[04:56:24] Hesperius > EM turns to piracy
[04:56:27] Tasadare > yes, we cna, end of transmisison,
[04:56:35] Kismo > No, you can't. End of transmission
[04:56:39] Kismo > Expect to see this on your RP forums.
[04:56:41] Tasadare > closing this channel
[04:56:48] Hesperius > hahaha
[04:56:57] ABNTanker > they really anti pirates?
[04:57:01] Hesperius > yes
[04:57:04] Hesperius > they claim to me
[04:57:06] Kismo > They're *supposed* to be
[04:57:07] ABNTanker > wierd
[04:57:07] Hesperius > *be
[04:57:08] Kismo > But they aren't.
[04:57:43] ABNTanker > what kind of security jit did they take for attacking me? cant stay positive if they keep doing it for long right?
[04:57:54] Kismo > They're just out for kicks
[04:58:06] Hesperius > and your loot
[04:58:10] Hesperius > yarrrr
[04:58:26] ABNTanker > made sure to overload everything I could lol
[04:59:02] Kismo > You did everything right
[04:59:18] Kismo > Not a lot to do when you're ganked by a Loki and Proteus

Here's a couple of screen shots:
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1005/2010....-_Copy.png
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1005/2010....-_Copy.png

Notice how both pilots have GCCs and ABNTanker does not? I have edited these pictures solely to change their image format (from BMP to PNG) to get them to upload to eve-files. I used MS Paint to do this. I am more than willing to email the original bmp files to Arthur Black or his chosen representative.

ABNTanker's combat history according to Battleclinic (I don't think he looks like a pirate with 17 losses and no recorded kills.... ever):
http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/co...=ABNTanker

This is my evemail communication with ABNTanker whereby I obtained the killmail:


Re: Mail
From: ABNTanker
Sent: 2010.05.11 06:11
To: Kismo,



--------------------------------
Mail
From: Kismo
Sent: 2010.05.11 06:04
To: ABNTanker,

Hey can I get that killmail? They didn't post it to battleclinic. You can get the killmail by:
Replying to me
Going to your character sheet
Going to your combat log
Going to losses
Clicking on the white paper next to the top Hurricane loss
Going back to this evemail response
Right click, Paste

This will help a lot in their prosecution!

2010.05.11 04:47:00

Victim: ABNTanker
Corp: Brutor tribe
Alliance: NONE
Faction: NONE
Destroyed: Hurricane
System: Floseswin
Security: 0.4
Damage Taken: 29307

Involved parties:

Name: Tasadare (laid the final blow)
Security: 1.3
Corp: Covenants United
Alliance: Electus Matari
Faction: NONE
Ship: Loki
Weapon: 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II
Damage Done: 16303

Name: Gistatis Tribunus / Angel Cartel
Damage Done: 7602

Name: Yen Mei
Security: 4.6
Corp: Covenants United
Alliance: Electus Matari
Faction: NONE
Ship: Proteus
Weapon: Acolyte II
Damage Done: 5402

Destroyed items:

Acolyte I (Drone Bay)
650mm Artillery Cannon II
Widowmaker Heavy Missile, Qty: 46
Medium Projectile Ambit Extension I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Small Armor Repairer I (Cargo)
Medium Anti-Explosive Pump I
Firefly F.O.F. Light Missile I, Qty: 100 (Cargo)
250mm Light Artillery Cannon I (Cargo)
Cap Recharger II
Damage Control II
250mm Light Artillery Cannon I
650mm Artillery Cannon I
650mm Medium 'Scout' Artillery I
Havoc Heavy Missile, Qty: 2
Widowmaker Heavy Missile, Qty: 4 (Cargo)
Fusion M, Qty: 79
Sensor Booster II

Dropped items:

650mm Artillery Cannon II
Advanced 'Limos' Heavy Missile Bay I, Qty: 2
Small Automated I Carapace Restoration
10MN MicroWarpdrive I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II, Qty: 2
Medium I-a Polarized Armor Regenerator (Cargo)
Fusion M, Qty: 1896 (Cargo)
720mm Howitzer Artillery I (Cargo)
EMP S, Qty: 2
'Malkuth' Heavy Missile Launcher I
Fusion M, Qty: 27
Mark I Generator Refitting: Reaction Control
Medium Hull Repairer I (Cargo)
Havoc Heavy Missile, Qty: 100 (Cargo)
Large Capacitor Battery II
Piranha Light Missile, Qty: 100 (Cargo)
Medium Armor Repairer II

I'm sure that the killmail can be validated by checking your pilots' or their corp's API and that you may contact ABNTanker on your own to verify my story.

Have fun!

//OOC content removed, as this is an IC forum. Nothing pertinent to the communication needed snipping though, just two references to roleplay and the word "NPC".

This kill have been explain on our killboard, ((and seem like you really want to ocntinu to smack like you did earlier))

Electus have to know Kismos and another one from your corporation was helping one orange from War.Pigs ''an outlaw alliance'' and didn't want to hear what we tell hem two times....This Capsuler's is RED toward Covenants until seems like a lot of times and a lot before we join the Electus.

I'Ve nothing to explain. We found a red, we probe, we kill. And I have a prober fitted because theres a lot of our ennemies who's unable to reach without, and because we goes somewhere in amarr empire to see if somes PIE was there.

Covenants does his job. Thanks for trying Kismos. I dosen't know our visite was so unnapreciate. Say Hi to war.pig from me.

And, if ABN have issues with our act. I suggest to contact me to explain a little bit his statut into our corproation ((does he just bought this account from a ninja loot?)). If not I'm the firts one to give it back a new ship if a bad issue of standing have been done.

---End of transmission---

I didn't smack you in the slightest, actually. I even posted the convo here for all to see. I, unlike you, have nothing to hide. Let's lay the truth out bare for everyone to see here.

You see, either your corp is marking people that don't even have a single kill recorded as red (let's read that as "you're pirates"), or you're full of crap about having an NPC corp or individual marked red. How long has it been since you've even been able to set standings to an individual for the corp? Two or three years now?

Man no matter how you slice this, its piracy. You can't hide behind what corp or alliance I am in, or I have been in. You are responsible for your own actions, and to be quite honest your actions represent Electus Matari as pirates.

Technical clarification: Corporations are able to set standings to individuals (just verified again via my own corp interface). Alliances can not.

Policy clarification: Our rules of engagement allow incurring a "global criminal flag" and security hit in the course of hunting valid targets, as not all pirates are kind enough to become outlaws. Likewise, a known pirate can not hope to hide in Tribe corporations.

Electus Matari does take this incident very serious, and we'll investigate these accusations with great care. Please understand that this will take some time. There is no use in throwing further accusations at each other here, unless anyone has more evidence pertaining the case at hand.

As a Ceo from my corporation I will certainly not began to discuss with someone who was himself with an outlaw, and update your implant, cause actually you can set standing for a corproation toward a single Capsuler's, and Electus can approove this, ((anyway I've just tested and it's work)).

I'm closing this discution for me and I'm waiting the concil for the rest.

and...Again, if engaging someone red in local ((from npc corp or not)) now have to be tchecked everytime, ask em, and I'll then give it bakc his ship for the issue and then stop patrolling and will sya as a civilian scientis..

I've done my job when I saw him red.

I would like to know why exactly you so want to see me kick out, only because someone you don'T know have been shooted down near of where I found you with somes pirates? You looks like someone who just want to pay us back what we do when we foudn you and this war.Pigs into a misison (we also wanted the drake outlaw one)

Anyway, this discuttion is going out of nowhere. You want to see us kicked out from the Electus for a question of veangance or I don'T really know.

I'm giving the rest to our alliance diplomate for the rest. These kind of historie don't let us want to do more operations.

((Yen Mey was also happy to do a kill until nearby a year...))

The rest is yours people.

(2010-05-11 07:52)Arkady Sadik Wrote: [ -> ]Policy clarification: Our rules of engagement allow incurring a "global criminal flag" and security hit in the course of hunting valid targets, as not all pirates are kind enough to become outlaws. Likewise, a known pirate can not hope to hide in Tribe corporations.

I was under the impression that someone had to have kills - perhaps even recent kills - in order to be a pirate? I think we can safely rule that out, considering he has no recorded kills in Battleclinic's very long memory! Really it begs me to ask just how long Electus Matari and its member corps hold a grudge?

And furthermore, what is your stance towards people that have formerly been pirates and given up the trade? And what is your stance towards people that their only crime is "helping" former pirates by attempting to rehabilitate them towards a new lifestyle of carebearism and/or faction activism?

(2010-05-11 07:52)Arkady Sadik Wrote: [ -> ]Electus Matari does take this incident very serious, and we'll investigate these accusations with great care. Please understand that this will take some time. There is no use in throwing further accusations at each other here, unless anyone has more evidence pertaining the case at hand.

I think that there's not much doubt that the kill happened - since it's posted on Battleclinic, your own killboard, and I have screen shots of it and the conversation in local. What I will say is that I've been hanging around for a while, and all I ever see ABNTanker doing is running missions and flying haulers.

Let me know if there's anything I can do to assist you.

(2010-05-11 07:56)Tasadare Wrote: [ -> ]As a Ceo from my corporation I will certainly not began to discuss with someone who was himself with an outlaw, and update your implant, cause actually you can set standing for a corproation toward a single Capsuler's, and Electus can approove this, ((anyway I've just tested and it's work)).

You threaten to come after me, personally, for bringing up an extremely suspicious kill against someone that I've never seen do anything but carebear for several months? Am I supposed to feel threatened here? You are stooping so low as to threaten personal punishment for someone that's inarguably doing their civic duty? Really??

Quote:I would like to know why exactly you so want to see me kick out, only because someone you don'T know have been shooted down near of where I found you with somes pirates? You looks like someone who just want to pay us back what we do when we foudn you and this war.Pigs into a misison (we also wanted the drake outlaw one)

If you're going to pirate, then pirate. Don't hide behind a massive anti-pirate alliance and then pirate behind their back! Also, you don't have to go beating around the bush here accusing me of consorting with pirates. I am a pirate.... but I'd argue that at least I'm honest about what I do.

Kismo Wrote:I was under the impression that someone had to have kills - perhaps even recent kills - in order to be a pirate?

Eh? Only to be a profitable one.

I believe that a very interesting piece of information has come into my hands here. I direct your attention to yet another exhibit - this one from Tasadare's own hand. http://img29.imageshack.us/i/20100511045755.png/

There are several important things to note here. First, we will note that ABNTanker is not actually marked red. He is marked as having aggression, because of defending himself from this brutal pirate attack. I would say that if ABNTanker is marked red to Tasadare's corp, it is part of an attempt to cover up an overt act of piracy.

Second, I draw your attention to the bottom where Tasadare says, "One hurricane just been killed... the jokey one's have tried earlier to shoot a tribal cruiser at a gate, 15 minutes later in a mission... we got it". This goes counter to all observed behavior for ABNTanker, and I do not believe that he was in fact attacking cruisers on a gate. Furthermore, I would like to point out at this point that 15 minutes prior (and for 5-10 minutes before that as well) Tasadare was trying to probe out various mission running carebears in another system. Yes, he even probed down a mission that I was helping one of these carebears with. This means that these Electus Matari pirates were not in fact in position to observe this hypothetical attack.

To recap: Tasadare's own visuals did not have ABNTanker marked as red even after the time of aggression, and the two pirates could not even have been in position to see this alleged extremely uncharacteristic attack by ABNTanker. I think it's clear that we have at least two pirates, and perhaps an entire pirate corp, hiding within the ranks of Electus Matari.

I apologize for not getting on the case sooner. It's unfortunately not always possible for me (or another diplomat) to catch these requests in a timely fashion.

Kismo, we'll look into it. Thank you for bringing it to our attention.

Everyone else, if you are not a diplomat, please refrain from further comments. Feel free to participate in any internal discussion though.